The future of the Gamble and Central Library

[HORT 1,625]

Today is World Book Day, and our famous Council have made this announcement about the future.

https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/news/17481575.multi-million-pound-investment-needed-for-gamble-building-council-leader-says/?ref=rss

 

[tessmop 280]

Leaving it for so long hasn't helped it,something should have been done before now, after all they can find money to buy Church Square and loan money  out to help other councils.

[RATTY 1,989]

I just wish they'd hurry up, people need the library. To get to Eccleston from where I live it would mean a bus into town and then one out to Eccleston because even though I live 10 minutes away by car there isn't a bus service. That means a fiver there and a fiver back. Fecking ridiculous.

added 5 minutes later

Like someone said in the comments. Buy the Citadel get it converted and put it there, then they can rebuild the Gamble at leisure over years and then return it when done.

Bet they won't though. Because this is all about their plan for the World of failing glass and moving the library to that end of town, it will be shoved in an unused room there for the least outlay

[Phyll 2,104]

Don't worry they are "Transforming Our Town". 

 

https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/news/17492752.plans-for-proposed-70m-glass-futures-facility-revealed/?ref=mr&lp=4

Edited March 12 by Phyll

[RATTY 1,989]

Transforming it by turning it into warehouse city. 

We were just saying at the weekend, makes you feel like leaving and never coming back for the shock of seeing that nothing remains of what we once were

added 0 minutes later

And that looks nothing like the town centre these days

[non sibi sed omnibus 830]

8 minutes ago, RATTY said:

Transforming it by turning it into warehouse city. 

We were just saying at the weekend, makes you feel like leaving and never coming back for the shock of seeing that nothing remains of what we once were

added 0 minutes later

And that looks nothing like the town centre these days

Well my mum was downstairs in the gamble,on a cooking lesson when she was a child.There was an explosion!

My gran was in the town hall tower when it was on fire.

We did try to redevelop for future geneerations! 

Edited April 8 by non sibi sed omnibus

[philthespark 375]

There's been talk about the Gamble being sold off to that firm who appear to be buying up loads of old buildings and turning them into executive apartment's. Now there are cleverer people than me on here and hopefully if push comes to shove someone may be able to make use of something I say. As far as I'm aware the 'Gamble' was gifted to the people of St Helens many years ago, and since it belongs to the people then the council cannot sell it, this may be of some importance in the future.

Some years back, our glorious council leaders wanted to sell off Earlestown market square, they very nearly got away with it until one bloke objected, saying that it was not theirs to sell, in fact it actually belonged to him. They asked how he came to think he owned it and he pointed out that the land was left to the good folk of Earlestown many many years earlier, as he was one of the 'good folk', he argued that it belonged to him, and others, and he certainly was not in favour of selling it, and so they couldn't.

We need to watch out that they don't try the same thing on with the 'Gamble', it's ours not theirs, the trouble is that as the older residents die off, the younger ones have no idea of who owns what, I believe that WE, also own Sherdley Park too, you can bet that will be on the for sale list, if the council get their way . 

[HORT 1,625]

When Victoria Park was sold to St Helens, it was a condition of the sale that is was for public use in perpetuity.

However the council have sold the Mansion House and surrounding gardens to  Age Concern.

Anyone know how?

 

[Dave 5,088]

Did they sell them or did they lease them? Was it an actual sale?

[HORT 1,625]

It does not matter, it is no longer for the use of the public.

Its for the use of who and when Age Concern say.

[RATTY 1,989]

We do own it, it was left along with a  trust fund to run it. As I said it has been slowly robbed from us. Don't know about Sherdley (owner sold it to St.Helens Corporation on June 27th 1949 for £18,700. At the time of the sale, local newspapers reported that the council intended to develop the estate along the lines of a cultural centre for sport and recreation, stating that "every effort will be made to retain the beauty of the parkland". ) ....but we all as a town own Taylor Park, it was gifted.

The mansion house and grounds were bought in 1886 for £11,000 by St Helens Corporation and the contents of the house and outbuildings were auctioned. 

They turned it into a museum but it closed in 1966 and all the exhibits went to the Gamble Institute. 

The building became the base for St Helens Parks and Cemeteries; however, was then abandoned and sadly become increasingly derelict. (What a surprise)

In 1993 a local charity – Age Concern St Helens – purchased the house and immediate grounds (including formal gardens, courtyard, outbuildings and parking areas) and set about restoring this beautiful venue. With restoration work complete (thanks to many volunteers), The Mansion House became an ‘Active Age Centre’ offering a range of services for older people (thanks to partnership working and support from external funding). 

[Dave 5,088]

I don't have any sentimental attachment to the Gamble - no more than any other buildings that have been sold and re-purposed or demolished. OK, it's one of the few old interesting looking buildings that are left, but the expense is like the albatross metaphor. A few people could make a fuss in the way philthespark advocates, but the council could just say "OK you fix it or pay for it to be fixed then."  Or should we pay more council tax for it?

Canny old Gamble - he was very 'shrewd' and he had 'gumption', enabling him to make an absolute fortune from his workers. It wasn't unusual for this sort of person to become all philanthropic in their old age. Towns and cities all over the country have similar monuments, kindly bestowed to the native populations - probably not only due to vanity but as a sort of an atonement. 

[non sibi sed omnibus 830]

Well us plebs used to get back though.Think of all the staples,paper clips,free leccy to power up your phones,things falling off the back of lorries(workers for catalogues),council workers paint,wallpaper.one couple of lads in century house ran a dating agency via council phones.

 

[philthespark 375]

On ‎11‎/‎04‎/‎2019 at 11:07, non sibi sed omnibus said:

Well us plebs used to get back though.Think of all the staples,paper clips,free leccy to power up your phones,things falling off the back of lorries(workers for catalogues),council workers paint,wallpaper.one couple of lads in century house ran a dating agency via council phones.

 

I remember in the mid 70's my uncle lived at Greenbank, before they messed about with the roads there used to be a subway nearby, opposite Windle Pilk school, and a pub on the other side, there was a roundabout iirc. Anyway one day a wagon loaded with boxes of glasses went over an lost it's load, I think it was from Ravenhead, by the time the authorities arrived to clean up the mess, the only thing left was a bit of broken glass and some cardboard, the locals had shifted the rest! You couldn't go anywhere in that part of St Helens for weeks after without being asked if you had/ wanted, any glasses. I even knew a few people who used the pint pots, the ones with handles, for drinking tea out of, "they're great" one old bloke told me, "I can actually have a decent drink out of one of these".

 

On ‎10‎/‎04‎/‎2019 at 22:10, RATTY said:

We do own it, it was left along with a  trust fund to run it. As I said it has been slowly robbed from us. Don't know about Sherdley (owner sold it to St.Helens Corporation on June 27th 1949 for £18,700. At the time of the sale, local newspapers reported that the council intended to develop the estate along the lines of a cultural centre for sport and recreation, stating that "every effort will be made to retain the beauty of the parkland". ) ....but we all as a town own Taylor Park, it was gifted.

The mansion house and grounds were bought in 1886 for £11,000 by St Helens Corporation and the contents of the house and outbuildings were auctioned. 

They turned it into a museum but it closed in 1966 and all the exhibits went to the Gamble Institute. 

The building became the base for St Helens Parks and Cemeteries; however, was then abandoned and sadly become increasingly derelict. (What a surprise)

In 1993 a local charity – Age Concern St Helens – purchased the house and immediate grounds (including formal gardens, courtyard, outbuildings and parking areas) and set about restoring this beautiful venue. With restoration work complete (thanks to many volunteers), The Mansion House became an ‘Active Age Centre’ offering a range of services for older people (thanks to partnership working and support from external funding). 

I may have been mistaken over the park, maybe it was Taylor park, several of my relatives many many moons ago worked for the council, one was head gardener at Sherdley, and one worked at the 'crem', he lived in one of those little cottages on hard lane, at the entrance.

I remember in the 80's working for the council on security for a short while, I was working nights on Victoria park, or 412 as it was known (radio call sign), we were based in the parks and gardens side and one night we heard a noise and there was a lad trying to break in. My mate ran after him and he headed for a high wall, I went around and grabbed him as he dropped down, I'll never forget it, he had this bloody great knife in his hand and went for me with it, luckily although it damaged my jacket I only ended up with a deep scratch across my stomach! We had the last laugh though, we caught him several weeks later when we were working at Sherdley Show, dragged him into the bushes and gave him a right kicking, lol.

[Robbob2010 9,453]

Buggers aren't they now carrying knives.

It frightens me as i'm always out but they are hooded up.

I've always been street wise but that has now gone. 

[philthespark 375]

10 hours ago, Robbob2010 said:

Buggers aren't they now carrying knives.

It frightens me as i'm always out but they are hooded up.

I've always been street wise but that has now gone. 

I used to be frightened of nothing, I'd go where I wanted, when I wanted and not think twice, now I get worried about going to the cashpoint. Ok I can handle myself, but these days you've no chance, they'll stab you before you know what's happening, it's pathetic. Whatever happened to the good old fist fight, like when we were young, maybe we should start a campaign to bring them back at least they proved something, I beat you, so I'm harder than you, but he beat me, so he's harder than me, it established a sort of pecking order, but now with a knife, or increasingly a gun a tiny person can take out the biggest. They say they carry weapons to get respect, HA, they don't even know the meaning of the word, respect is something you earn, not something that you get because you carry a weapon.

[Robbob2010 9,453]

I will get back on to that Philthespark on another topic but getting back to the Gamble building i was told that it will never open.

I was told that all the small library's was going to close with the cutbacks and Gamble was going to be the main one..guess i was told the opposite. 

[philthespark 375]

13 minutes ago, Robbob2010 said:

I will get back on to that Philthespark on another topic but getting back to the Gamble building i was told that it will never open.

I was told that all the small library's was going to close with the cutbacks and Gamble was going to be the main one..guess i was told the opposite. 

I think it's the usual one mate, they tell you what they think you want to hear, but do what is best for them. At this rate there's be nothing for future generations.

[Phyll 2,104]

  Let's hope this comes to fruition.

https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/news/17583960.st-helens-labour-pledges-major-capital-investment-on-gamble-building/?fbclid=IwAR1aF93frUpFqzgC0Vb0-svXeqaubNGWsfrs-0uMF6nsKnlwXMBhkg_If88

[RATTY 1,989]

Temporary ....yeah right. 

I don't even particularly care where it is as long as it's  adequate. The thing I can't stand is the underhand way they did it, treating us like we're stupid and don't matter, now they have cottoned on that they may well lose out, all of a sudden they come out with this   

and this

 

 

Edited 14 hours ago by RATTY

[halj 47]

Do they want to get rid of the Gamble building?

 

[non sibi sed omnibus 830]

All this MOANING!Bet they still vote Labour in yet again?Its like moaning that if you put  your finger in the fire it gets burned.BUT YET YOU STILL DO IT.

[Alan 2,582]

3 minutes ago, non sibi sed omnibus said:

Bet they still vote Labour in yet again

It's in St Helens DNA