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mishka last won the day on February 2

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About mishka

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  • Birthday 28/04/1947

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  1. If you are/were (is it still there?) standing on the last part brook facing the back of the houses Boundary Road was there some sort of factory building to your right? A single storey brick building? My cousin and I had the brook as a playground during the early 50's and we cannot for the life of us remember what that building was - or if it was just the side of a house or shop (she thinks maybe a chip shop?) and did a bomb drop near there during the war or is that a false memory of something we thought our Nans told us? It's drivimg us mad, we can't find any photos or anything to use as reference.
  2. 1921 census due to be released by Findmypast January 2022
  3. Thank you so much for that Ratty - i took the plunge yesterday and got his updated army records - and they gave a description of him - I now know as well where my uncle Harry got his brown eyes from - my dad and his other brother Arthur had blue eyes, but all had the black hair. His profession was down as master crown glassmaker - and he was just 18 when he enlisted, so he must have been employed from a young age and remployed as soon as he got back to Sctland and then poached by Pilks. He was an out pensioner with the Royal Chelsea and paid 3 visits to the hospital during his time in St Helens for 'pectoral complaint' - didn't stop him working though. Just this Brownlows place now - I'm guessing it was accomodation provided for the family when they first moved and then they were given the house in Pilkington Row. Miore digging today to see if I can find the place. Hope you're well.
  4. Thanks Dave - I now know where I am re Pilkington Row and it's given me a lot of food for thought. NSSO - yes, it's about my father's family the Holdens/Holdings/Holdons. They moved from Dumbarton in about 1835 and I cannot get my head round why? Thomas Holding was an ex soldier who fought in America and other places and was on a good Chelsea 'out' pension after being badly wounded in America and shipped home to Woolwich Kent. He went back to Scotland with his wife Sarah (Irish) and had 5 children when they moved to St Helens. He is listed as a master glass maker but how did he go from being a Scots ex soldier living in the wilds of Dumbarton to being a glassmaker in St helens working for Pilks? They were in Brownlows buildings in 1841 but Pilkington Row for the rest of their lives - children living in their own homes there as well. They had 7 surviving children by 1841 - they must have been squashed in like sardines and I'm guessing that the home in Pilkington Row later on would have been 3 bedrooms max? Whatever got them to St Helens the tradition of being a Pilks man carried on down the generations to my brother, who was the last to work for Pilks, but as a builder, and he left when his apprenticeship finished, the rest were glass makers. I've been looking at this for years and it's doing my head in now - why glass? Where did they learn to work glass? There were no glassworks in the area of Scotland where they came from. How did they find out about St Helens and more to the point - how the hell did they travel there? Any help would be really appreciated.
  5. Can anyone give me a rough idea of where these building were in the 1840's? and where Pilkington Row was? No good pointing me to a map - I don't know where to look!!
  6. If you google Kings Own Royal Regiment it will bring up the history of the regiment on wikipedia - go onto that page and you can see where the regiment served during WW2 and their campaigns. You can't obviously find John Taberner in person but it will give you good idea of where he served. He died young didn't he? 1979 - only 57.
  7. Two Fred Gilvray - Fred born to Daniel and Jane in 1891 - died 1917. Sergeant F Gilvray 300253 The Kings (Liverpool Reg.) 18th btn died 8th October 1917 aged 23. Buried St Sever France - son of Daniel and Jane Ann Fred Gilvray born April 1919 the son of Alfred (son of Daniel and Jane) and Clara Houghton died 17th September 1943. Sapper Fred Gilvray 1908119 Royal Engineers - aged 24 when he died. In Salerno War Cemetary, Italy. Marked as the son of Alfred and Clara
  8. Yep - 'tis true! A relative in the US sent me copies of the actual bmd records for Great Budworth in the late 1600's and early 1700's and these two were in the listings. She got them for me when she was doing her own research in one of the Mormon family history centres. I've always wanted to know what the 'get thee behind me' one did to deserve that as a name! Or rather what did his mother do?
  9. Wonder if thery palled up with two of mine - Oh be Joyful and Get thee behind me Satan Ryder. Cousins from Cheshire who obviously had religious backgrounds? I often wonder what the hell the vicar thought when he was called on to christen those two!
  10. Hi Rats m- hope you're well? Think I've solved your problem - got fed up with doing my Manx records so did a bit of digging around last night to give my head a rest. There were two Charlotte Arnolds: The first one: born 1836 to Richard Arnold and Mary - in 1841 they were living in Elephant Lane. in 1851 Charlotte was 15 and a servant in Sutton. In the December quarter of 1854 she married Patrick James Clarke, born in Ireland - vol 8B page 890. They lived in Parr until they died. He sometimes went as James, but was buried in St Helens as Patrick James Clarke June 1891 aged 51. Charlotte was buried 5th June 1907 same grave aged 71. The second one: Charlot or Charlotte Arnold born 1834 to Thomas Arnold a farmer and Grace. In 1841 they were living at Highland Brow Prescot - Charlotte born 1834 and her sister Grace born 1832. In 1851 Charlotte is 17 and Grace 19. In 1854 Charlot (that's how it's spelled in the record) married William Scallan - the march quarter - in a civil ceremony. Vol 8B page 721 (I've checked the actual written records and his vol and page number are the same). In the March quarter of 1857 Charlot died at Prescot Vol 8b page 358. In the March quarter of 1862 at West Derby Grace Arnold married William - down as Scottan in the records. Vol 8b page 602. You are right - he did marry two sisters. No idea what Charlot/Charlotte died of as I didn't look for a written record. Will see if I can find one for my own curiosity.😏
  11. 1901 - 33 Bolton Street St Helens John Tabern 50 living on own means Mary Ann wife 51 William son 23 coal hewer John son 21 brick maker Thomas son 19 brick maker Elizabeth A daughter 16 Sarah daughter 14 1911 595 Boardmans Lane John Taberner 60 chemical labourer Mary wife 60 William son single 33 coal mine hewer John son married 30 coal mine hewer Lom (This is the image on census) male 27 coal mine hewer Elizabeth daughter married 26 Sarah daughter married 24 Mary Ann Ranson granddaughter 16 Married for 34 years, six children, five surviving, one died.
  12. Baptism: 7th March 1852 St Michael Burtonwood, Lancs. John Tabbern (child) of William Parr and Elizabeth Tabbern spinster - born 16th November. Abode Father of Parr Mother of Sutton - father occupation labourer Notes: Illegitimate Baptised by W G Thomas
  13. Double checked the surname as spelled two different ways - the correct spelling is CURGENVEN - rest of info from marriage of William to Esther Brazier: William Curgenven was married to Amelia Neihus and they had children: Ellen Elizabeth Julia - born 1884 died 3/3/1886: Amelia born 1898 married 31/1/1920 at St Mary Magdalene church Adelaide to Herbert George Robert Willmott, the son of Edward Prime Willmott: Lillian born 1890 married 27/6/1914 to John Betrand Sellers aged 32 the son of Samuel Lightfoot Sellers. Marriage took place at Methodist Manse S. Australia: Hilda born 1891 married 23/4/1911 at St Bartholomews Church, Norwood, S Australia to Albert Harris, 25, the son of Emanuel Mendal Harris. Bertha married in 1912 to Thomas J Stokes at Broken Hill Adelaide. William Frederick born 1893 married at the Church of Christ Marylands 23/3/1929 to Laurel Jean Sinclair Halliday, 26, the daughter of Charles Grant Halliday. William Frederick enlisted in 1915 into the 27th Battalion of the Australian Imperial Forces, service no 2344 and was demobbed in 1919 with the rank of corporal and returned to Australia. Amelia Curgenven nee Neihus died 17/12/1898 aged 34 and William then married Esther Brazier later. there are no census records in Australia - they were destroyed after the information was checked to protect privacy, so I have to try to find other sources to find your relatives. Giving my head a rest over the weekend and then will carry on digging if you want.
  14. Only May Elizabeth, Muriel and Winifred Esther Curgenven were children of William and Esther nee Brazier. The others listed above were half siblings from William's first marriage to Amelia ? who died. However Esther Brazier had an illigitimate daughter on the 14th September 1891. Edith Adams Brazier born to Esther Brazier and John Adams in Adelaide. They never married and she went on to marry William Curgenven. John Adams married maybe?
  15. Curvengen family originally from Cornwall. Benjamin was a widower on ship and on arrival, but married on death cert - must have remarried in Adelaide. Curvengens still going strong in Australia - have emailed one on Wikitree to see if he can help you. Will let you know if he replies.
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