13 replies to this topic

[HORT]

An Ancient Woodland, is defined as a wooded area that has existed continuously since before the year 1600.

According to Wikipeadia, the only Ancient Woodland in St Helens is the wooded area between Carr Mill Dam and the Railway Line.

http://en.wikipedia....i/Carr_Mill_Dam

Surely there must be other Ancient Woodland in the Town? For example how long has Clinkham Wood been there?

[Olliebeak]

Probably part of the same 'woodland area' at one time, HORT.

There must have been lots of clearing done in the19th/ 20th century for the modern developments (including the cemetery in 1850's) - but even earlier than all that happening, surely the woodland was originally cleared to make way for the many farms in the area.

[Phyll]

Hort, Here are a couple of interesting links for you to look at.

http://www.sthelens....gnl.htm?id=1009

http://www.visitsthe...reserve-p150401

[llanyb]

You could always do your own infromal survey when/if ? you go for a walk. A number of wild plants are considered good indicators of ancient/long-established woodlands. I'm no expert but I know the OH gets quite excited when she comes across herb paris or moscatel (and many others).

Just had a quick scan over the first edition OS maps, surveyed in the 1850s, and most woodland in and around StH seems to be named 'plantation' which would seem to indicate that they're heavily managed if not man-made woodlands.

[edit for second para]

Edited by llanyb, 20 April 2011 - 09:56 AM.

[Alan]

My memory of St Helens and District woodlands from the 60s is that they were all with very few exceptions maintained as cover for the various game-birds that our local landed gentry ritually slaughtered on a fairly regular basis

[SWIMMER]

Carmill woods I think is an overall name for the woods that stretch from the ship and extend right the way through to carmill, We used to take our children on this walk regulary and it is plain by as Lb says the wild growth that these are woods. Bluebell wood I think that is Clinkenwood and the area behind the ship was all woodlands and farmland sadly the link road destroyed much of that and did precious little to aleviate the traffic problem.

[leschip]

I would have thought that Knowsley Park, part of which is in St Helens (Blue Door Lodge etc) is Ancient Woodland.

[SWIMMER]

Lord Derby's estate must also be, Is that where you are talking about Leschip. Geography not my strong suite lol

[Olliebeak]

According to this article, the grounds at Knowsley Park were designed by Capability Brown, but could just mean the 'formal part of the gardens' - http://en.wikipedia....y_Hall#Parkland

[Phyll]

I don't think Knowsley was an "Ancient Woodland" though. I believe Speke Hall has Ancient Woodlands with Bluebell Woods.

http://www.flickr.co...N07/3512653130/

I love Capability Brown and have been to a few of his Gardens over the years.

http://en.wikipedia....bility%22_Brown

[leschip]

I was a bit loose with my posting. Knowsley Park, before it was known as such, was a Royal Hunting Ground/ Forest. It was hunted in by Henry 1V. In fact the upkeep was undertaken by the Clergy of Prescot, and this led to the founding of Kings College Cambridge in 1461. King H noted that the Vicar was loaded and "persuaded" him to cough up a quid or two to help fund education, Kings Cambridge hold most of the land title in the Prescot area.

[llanyb]

/pedantry warning/ Capability Brown didn't do 'formal'

[leschip]

leschip, on 21 April 2011 - 08:05 AM, said:

I was a bit loose with my posting. Knowsley Park, before it was known as such, was a Royal Hunting Ground/ Forest. It was hunted in by Henry 1V. In fact the upkeep was undertaken by the Clergy of Prescot, and this led to the founding of Kings College Cambridge in 1461. King H noted that the Priests were loaded and "persuaded" them to cough up a quid or two to help fund education, Kings Cambridge hold most of the land title in the Prescot area.

Edited by leschip, 21 April 2011 - 01:23 PM.

[billlingecelt]

Ok you cant get older than old Welsh etymology in other words the Celtic name for woodland.I would suggest the woodland that runs from Billinge to Carr Mill is rather old its called Pen-Y-Goyt .Its the woodland that leads down to Red river at the side of the land formerly known as the 'Deer park'and yes there where Deer on Lord Gerrards estate,the village of Gars wood was named after them 'Gar' being an old name for Deer.