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underdog last won the day on April 23 2015

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  1. "Young Jingler"?

    Maps as promised: A larger area view & a close-up from 1892.
  2. "Young Jingler"?

    Well, nowhere now. It looks to have been down near the bottom end of Carr Lane about halfway between the pond & where the roundabout is now. As far as I can tell it wasn't a perfect octagon, the photo seems to be end-on. Think of a standard rectangular-shaped house with trapezoid extensions at either end. I'll post some maps when I can remember how to do it here. I'm pretty sure it's William & Ellen & possibly Maria. Re: your photographer theory, Old Jingler was apparently William according to my cousins memories of how their mother remembered him. The younger William was my G-Grandfather. It gets a bit confusing as William jr. was born just before his parents married so was baptised under his mother's maiden name of Stott. While he was a minor, he was recorded on censuses (thanks for the plural Gervassutti) as Leadbetter but went back to Stott when he got older.
  3. "Young Jingler"?

    Could very well be, I was just guessing based on the clothing. Is there any info on when the building was demolished? The census shows it was there in 1911 & according to a cursory search of the maps at nls.uk the area is part of the BI by the mid-30s. Also, what was the building originally? It looks like a glorified gazebo judging by all the blocked-up windows.
  4. "Young Jingler"?

    Just heard from jacquelinejean (my cousins BTW - I told them about this forum ages ago, it took them long enough to get here) & this is actually who their mother (my Aunt Hilda) referred to as Old Jingler - still no idea why although he's got his hands in his pockets which may be a clue Definitely not his father Richard, he lived in the middle of Prescot - Houghton St. , Eccleston St. & Kemble St. according to the censuses (censii? - whatever) which makes more sense for a watchmaker, the Carrs would be a bit far away from the centre of operations.
  5. "Young Jingler"?

    Judging by the clothes, this looks to be c.1910ish so it's possibly my G-G-Grandfather William Leadbetter with his 2nd wife Ellen &, presumably his/her daughter about whom I have no information at all. Only William & Ellen are listed as living there in the 1911 census. Thanks for this, if I'm right this is now the only photo I have of him.
  6. "Old Jingler" Carrs cottage.

    Richard died in 1895. William was his son.
  7. South Lancs Regiment pic

    No idea, IIRC the name Ashcroft hasn't turned up in my family tree research. Here's the info as given to me by Dave Risley: Jones Frederick 21376, Pve, 11.S.Lancs, Ham 24.3.18 nicht verw. Giessen, 14.5.89 Birkenhead, Mr Jones 322 Elephant Lake St Helens. [international Committee of the Red Cross, P.A. 26590] Jones Frederick 21376, Gem, South Lancs 11.Batn C, Ham 24.3.18 Keine Wunde Lager III Munster, 14.5.89 Birkenhead, Mr Jones 322 Elephant Lane St Helens. [international Committee of the Red Cross, P.A. 27066] Jones Frederick 21376, Pve, 11 South Lancash. Rgt C, Ham 24.3.18 Behain Unverwundet, 14.3.89 Birkenhead, Mrs F.Jones 322 Elephant Lane Thitto Health St Helens Lancashire. [international Committee of the Red Cross, P.A. 30157] As you can see, the first two list Mr. Jones (presumably his father Edward) as next of kin but the third lists Mrs. Jones (not Mrs. F. Jones as stated above) I don't know much about Fred so it's either his Mother or his wife if he had one at that time. Or maybe just a typo on the original. If you look at original POW documents, they're not very clear after all this time which makes them difficult to read. There's always a chance of mistakes in transcription creeping in - like Thitto Heath (it's actually that on the original). The address seems to be right though in this case Who else is listed on the AVL for that address & when? The family moved around a lot so Joseph Ashcroft may be totally unconnected. They were certainly in Elephant Lane in the 1911 census &, judging by these records, up to at least 1918.
  8. South Lancs Regiment pic

    Update (if anyone's still interested) It's my Great-Uncle Fred Jones who was in the S. Lancs photo, just got confirmation. He was a Private in the 11th Bttn, enlisted in 1915 & was a POW following the German offensive (Operation Michael) from March 1918. The Red Cross POW records give his home address at the time as 322 Elephant Lane which (if memory serves) is the same as on the 1911 census. Apparently the photo is similar to others taken during a route march in the Grantham area so presumably it can be dated to early in the war c. 1915.
  9. Stoves team 1955

    Two more names found Mick Shanley & Chris Maguire
  10. Stoves team 1955

    I posted the photo on the "Born & raised in Prescot" facebook page & got a few more IDs 2nd from left, front row - Gordon Griffiths 3rd from left, back row - Jack Fishwick Derek Derbyshire & Georgie Flynn also identified but not placed.
  11. Stoves team 1955

    I found this photo & wondered if anyone had any more information. The back is stamped 6 May 1955 Front row extreme right is my Dad Bill Jones. There's a handwritten note on the back which looks like "Enamel Shop" which is where my dad worked so I assume it's a Stoves works team.
  12. South Lancs Regiment pic

    Slight update - After looking at a few more family photos there's a possibility that it isn't my grandfather Harry but his brother Fred. Which would make more sense of the only records showing him with the 9th Essex. I'm pretty sure this is him (seated) but so far I've only found pictures of him 7 years younger & 10 years older. However, the photo fits in with him being a L/Cpl in the Essex Regt. & he definitely isn't the other guy.
  13. South Lancs Regiment pic

    Thanks Ratty but it turns out that wasn't him (see above posts #8 & #9). Nice try though.
  14. Help with indentifying trophies

    Thanks, that's what I vaguely remember being told although it was the other (Finlayson/Stott) side of the family who were mostly bowlers. Not sure it's a teapot though, maybe a claret jug?
  15. Sutton Heath AFC

    Thanks - a google search turned up absolutely nothing about Sutton Heath AFC. Harry was a miner (a bloody young one judging by the photo) so it may have been a colliery team. The family seems to have moved around a lot, He was born in Ashton-in-Makerfield, his parents were both from Flintshire (good luck searching for Joneses there! ) his older siblings were all born in Birkenhead & a younger sister was born back in Mostyn. At the time of this photo the family were in the St Helens area, after WWI he moved to Bishop Aukland Co. Durham & married a local lass (my dad & his 2 brothers were all born up there). They all moved back down here to Rainhill in about 1925 & by the end of WWII they were almost all in Prescot. Confusing huh?